Safari / Scorpio / Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

[raj_5004]

I remember in some other thread, admist a discussion, we were debating that the Bolero is not an SUV whereas for me, it is. In another thread, some members classified the Scorpio as MUV+, whereas again I think that Scorpio is an SUV.

Well, i agree that the above may not be hardcore off roaders like the gypsy, Thar, Hummer or the Land Rover but nevertheless, its not necessary that all SUVs have to be great off roaders. Some SUVs are simply decent off roaders, like the Scorpio & Safari.

What is necessary in an SUV?
1) Good ground clearance
2) Good approach angle/attack angle
3) Good departure angle
4) Good ramp breakover angle
5) Decent articulation
6) 4x4 option
7) Low range

Arent these the basics?

The Scorpio & Safari has all of the above with shift on the fly. Then why is it not an SUV? What does they not have that a Fortuner has? So if Fortuner can be an SUV, why is the Scorpio or Safari an MUV+???

Some say, even the Safari is an SUV but the Scorpio isnt!!! Scorpio has a better attack angle & departure angle than the safari. due to shorter wheelbase, breakover angle of scorpio is better too. yes, it lacks LSD. The same manufacturer (DANA) supplies axles to both the Scorpio & Safari.

Coming to the bolero, even it has all of the above except shift on the fly. Hardcore off roaders prefer mechanical shifting rather than shift on the fly as they believe electronics have a greater chance of failing in extreme conditions. So why is the Bolero 4x4 not an SUV?

For those you dont believe, you should try googling or search in youtube for bolero 4x4.

For me, MUVs are Xylo, Innova, Grande & Tavera. They cant do even a little bit of off roading. But Bolero, Scorpio & Safari can manage a fair bit of off roading even in 4x2 form, mainly due to their superior "angles".

 

[Vishwas]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

Uh oh i voted wrongly for MUV instead of SUV,sorry

Bolero,safari and Scorpio is really an SUV which is made with low cost where people who cannot afford more than 15Lakhs can do offroading adventures and some comfort with added styling.

 

[AppU]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

Raj,

In my point of view, I would definetely say Safari , Scorpio & Bolero are off-roaders.


They have ability to thread anywhere.

 

[type-r]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

SUV does not mean only LRs and Hummers and etc. LRs can go off-road and so can Safari/Scorpio. LRs can seat seven and so can Scorpio/Safari. Then why not classify it as SUV? just because it isnt sold in all the countries in the world, thats why? Porsche Cayenne cannot do off road and also cannot seat 7 then is it not a SUV? also the people who call Scorpio/Safari MUV just because it can seat 7 mean that LR Discovery is a MUV since even that can seat 7?

i agree with all of Raj's points.

 

[TSIVipul]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

Definitely SUVs,especially the Bolero.
Bolero is a true VFM budget SUV which has proven mechanicals and is very reliable too.

 

[cooldhaya]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

I don't know much about the Bolero but yes i would definitely say Scorpio and Safari are SUV'S , they have all the traits of an SUV. True they are not hardcore off-roaders but they are our desi budget SUV'S which can do some off-roading.

 

[S Class]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

Bolero is actually goods mover with roof & seats thrown in, see the pick-up;
Scorpio is small truck as it is sold on same chassis outside India, or best can be called off-roader in 4x4 version,
Safari is the sole vehicle which is purely meant for humans.

I voted for MUV+, but bolero is just MUV, not even MUV+.

And just ground clearance, or 4x4 isn't what is required.
What does S stands for in SUV ? If one knows, he will understand why Porsche Cayenne or Merc M Class is SUV but not scorpio or for that matter even Ford Endy.

 

[raj_5004]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

Bolero is actually goods mover with roof & seats thrown in, see the pick-up;

Oh really? any facts to show that Bolero is a goods mover? Please care to enlighten us. Thanks in advance.

Scorpio is small truck as it is sold on same chassis outside India, or best can be called off-roader in 4x4 version,

Ok, bolero is a good mover & scorpio is a truck! Again, any specific reasons?

Safari is the sole vehicle which is purely meant for humans.

I was expecting a fanboy comment now! Again, please care to explain!

I voted for MUV+, but bolero is just MUV, not even MUV+.

Why is Bolero an MUV?

And just ground clearance, or 4x4 isn't what is required.

Please read the first post before posting. Havent I mentioned 4WD? Point number 6, to be more precise.

What does S stands for in SUV ? If one knows, he will understand why Porsche Cayenne or Merc M Class is SUV but not scorpio or for that matter even Ford Endy.

So even Endy is a MUV? Thats hilarious! Keep it coming!

Again, please share as to why you think so rather than just posting blank & open ended statements.

P.S.: If 9 people think its a SUV & only you think its an MUV+, then you must be having some strong logic behind it...

 

[Vishwas]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

Bolero is actually goods mover with roof & seats thrown in, see the pick-up;

See we Indians prefer more of utility than comfort and price is the main factor,so people(family of 5 and above) in middle income group will choose Bolero
and if people start thinking like you,it would have not been the country's largest selling SUV.And moreover Bolero has proportional SUV looks unlike bare boxy Sumo and its predecessors.

In Bangalore people call Indica and logan(aka Verito) as a cab vehicle only will you accept that fact?

Scorpio is small truck as it is sold on same chassis outside India, or best can be called off-roader in 4x4 version,

Scorpio was first an SUV and then came its truck version,so how can you call it a truck! people don't know the difference!

Safari is the sole vehicle which is purely meant for humans.

Awesome comment!
And humans decided to become animals by looking at the Beast Scorpio why? because it is one vehicle which comes roaring unlike the PUNY safari
Probably you are working for tata and maybe getting Rs.something for praising their products, so biased!

I voted for MUV+, but bolero is just MUV, not even MUV+.

Whatever maybe,but it has got thing!

What does S stands for in SUV ? If one knows, he will understand why Porsche Cayenne or Merc M Class is SUV but not scorpio or for that matter even Ford Endy.

Tell their owners to compete with Scorpio on our country's toughest terrains,they will not even leave asphalt,just a waste.

You are living in a country that is developing still so better try to praise our Indian Manufacturers,they have proven better in our country.

 

[S Class]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

Oh really? any facts to show that Bolero is a goods mover? Please care to enlighten us. Thanks in advance.

See pic below. Can't explain it in words now.

Ok, bolero is a good mover & scorpio is a truck! Again, any specific reasons?

Again see pic below.

I was expecting a fanboy comment now! Again, please care to explain!

Safari doesn't come as pick-up, as simple as that.

Why is Bolero an MUV?

As it is used to transport goods + some people.

Please read the first post before posting. Havent I mentioned 4WD? Point number 6, to be more precise.

You first read my post carefully. I said, "And just ground clearance, or 4x4 isn't what is required."
Ask some school boy what does this mean.
It simply means that for SUV, we need something more than this.

So even Endy is a MUV? Thats hilarious! Keep it coming!

Don't put words in my mouth. When did I say endy to be MUV ? I said it is truck & truck is not MUV.

P.S.: If 9 people think its a SUV & only you think its an MUV+, then you must be having some strong logic behind it...

Yes, I don't have HERD MENTALITY. Simple.

 

[raj_5004]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

See pic below. Can't explain it in words now.

Again see pic below.

Nice logic indeed!

So look at the pics below -




So going by your above logic,

1) Hummer is not an SUV, but is a good carrier
2) Toyota Fortuner & Toyota Innova is not meant for humans since it is based on the Hilux.

Most importantly, why dint you consider this -



Grande has the same chassis, same engine, same mechanicals. Only the body & dash is a bit different.

So grande is not a good carrier or is it not fit for humans? somehow it may not be applicable in this case, since it is a TATA right?

Have you heard of something called as a lifestyle pickup? Google it. The Getaway & Xenon is just that! Not to be confused with a goods carrier.

As it is used to transport goods + some people.

You mean 8000 people a month buy the Bolero to transport goods?

You first read my post carefully. I said, "And just ground clearance, or 4x4 isn't what is required."

Sorry, please frame it properly. I dint understand what you meant.

Ask some school boy what does this mean.

Thats why I am asking you...

It simply means that for SUV, we need something more than this.

A TATA badge would be enough I guess, ehh?

Don't put words in my mouth. When did I say endy to be MUV ? I said it is truck & truck is not MUV.

Then what is the Endy?

MUV+?
NS-SUV = Non-sports SUV?

 

[S Class]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

@raj,

Whatever I had to say, I said that with some pics. Those who got the point will understand, those who haven't can learn from you.

And to cut long story short based on the pics posted by you;

Hummer > Never considered it as civilian vehicle. Anyways, FYI, it is over an year since the production has halted & hummer is no longer there. RIP.

Grande > Please show me verbatim where I said it to be SUV. It is MUV/pick-up;

Fortuner > I always call it a truck. See my older posts.

 

[mukeshus]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

Here is a Scorpio Getaway with Crde 2.6 engine, but with refresh headlamps.

This engine is heavy than mHawk.

Brute 4X4 offroader, it has been modified to serve its purpose of offroading.

 

[raj_5004]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

WOOOH! Drool worthy! Looks killer.

 

[TSIVipul]

Re: Safari/Scorpio/Bolero - SUV, MUV or MUV+?

Here is a Scorpio Getaway with Crde 2.6 engine, but with refresh headlamps.

This engine is heavy than mHawk.

Brute 4X4 offroader, it has been modified to serve its purpose of offroading.

Rocking...
Even I too dream of getting one such off-road machine some day,same design was in mind:-
Fat off-road lights(fog lamps).
A winch.
Black alloys with off-road tyres.
And the position of the exhaust pipe is same as I think of.
Only problem is that in my dream comes a Xenon...
Here is one image(from Google but from TAI itself,don't know which member posted it):-