Gandhiji's India is Changing!

[manojodungat]

2nd October, 2013

Gandhiji's India has changed a lot. For the current generation, values like truth and courage are least followed while keeping up with the pace in this globalised world. Though we pretend to live an "Urban" life, the economic developments and benefits are confined mostly to the urban societies. While the rural still fights poverty, rampant greed and widespread violence have already affected normal living in this modern India.

I thought, it's worthwhile to revisit the ideals, values and virtues of Gandhiji, which might have been very well forgotten and considered irrelevant.

You must be the change you wish to see in the world.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.

You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty.

It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of nonviolence to cover impotence.

A 'No' uttered from the deepest conviction is better than a 'Yes' merely uttered to please, or worse, to avoid trouble.

Even if you are a minority of one, the truth is the truth.

An ounce of practice is worth more than tons of preaching.

Mahatma Gandhi

Hoping to see a better tomorrow

 

[Tornado]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

@mu,I disagree with you buddy, Gandhiji's India has not at all changed. Only difference is that now IT is exposing the truths better than before.

BTW, term India and nation India never existed in the minds of locals till the Englishmen labelled it so and attached it with their empire.

 

[manojodungat]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

@mu,I disagree with you buddy, Gandhiji's India has not at all changed. Only difference is that now IT is exposing the truths better than before.
BTW, term India and nation India never existed in the minds of locals till the Englishmen labelled it so and attached it with their empire.

By "Gandhiji's India", I meant our own country- Hindustan.
By "changes", I meant the degradation in values in our society- the moral deterioration of youth in our country.The youth power is the driving force towards the development of the nation, provided they are focussed and not adversely diverted.

“I fully subscribe to the judgment of those writers who maintain that of all the difference between man and the lower animals, the moral sense or conscience is by far the most important”.
Charles Darwin, The Descent of Man.

 

[ZenandEnfield]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

In the past, on Gandhi Jayanthi, they would show a patriotic movie on Doordarshan (DD) like 'Gandhi'. And on Independence day & Republic day, they would show movies like 'Border'. The whole family would gather and watch it. Everyone bought flags and tied it to their bike's handlebars, including me. But in recent years, they screened on Independence day the movie called, 'Independence day' starring Will Smith. And on Republic day, 'Avatar' was shown. This year, on Gandhi Jayanthi, there was nothing special on cable TV with almost 100 channels, in 7 languages. One local channel showed a few B&W photos of Gandhi.

People's values, morals and ethics have changed; and it is for the worse

 

[Tornado]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

@zae, moral values and ethics has nothing do with flag on handlebar, which movie on which day. Yesterday, I heard a song 'char baj gaye, lekin party abhi baki hain, valeti pee gaye lekin desi a abhi baki hain 'on most of the FM channels . But seriously felt that airing ' Raghupati raghao rajaramis not going help either.

@mu,I also ment that India, Bharat, Hindustan are synonyms. I was pointing toward words 'nation as a concept '.

Only difference between Gandhi era and now is that the population was 33cr, now it is 110cr.

 

[manojodungat]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

@mu,I also ment that India, Bharat, Hindustan are synonyms. I was pointing toward words 'nation as a concept '.
Only difference between Gandhi era and now is that the population was 33cr, now it is 110cr.

I am sorry to say that certain things have certainly changed in our country, irrespective of whether you agree or not.For you it may just be limited to the increase in the population, but its the number of instances/incidents, with people slipping down BELOW the level of animals, happening among this increased population is more alarming, as far as I am concerned. A moral evolution is what is expected and not moral degradation.

 

[Tornado]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

For you it may just be limited to the increase in the population, but its the number of instances/incidents, with people slipping down BELOW the level of animals, happening .

buddy, corruption, rapes, murders, burglary, oppression, castism etc. were very common in old days also, it is bound increase proportionally along with rise in population.
All these incidents use to go unreported due to lack of IT.

It was the era of British Police which was keeping the things in control and it has nothing to do with Gandhiji.

 

[manojodungat]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

All these incidents use to go unreported due to lack of IT.
It was the era of British Police which was keeping the things in control and it has nothing to do with Gandhiji.

Buddy, you are free to deny any credits to the Father of our Nation. Unfortunately, this thread hasn't been created for that.You seem to have taken it in a wrong sense.

BTW, in Kerala in the last five to six years or so, I see a trend where certain group of "new generation" openly making public places for their evil acts of drinking and also for making sexually suggestive remarks towards women shamelessly. The auto-rickshaws have become mobile bars and streets occupied by eve-teasers especially post 4.00pm.

 

[Tornado]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

Father of the nation deserves full credit for independence, no second thought about that in my mind.
Happenings in kerala and other parts of nation are due to misinterpretation of meaning of democracy. And in true sense it is the mobocracy which rules in India rather than democracy. And all these happenings has nothing to do with Gandhiji.

Gandhiji was always against alcohol but our nation never adopted that policy even when he was alive. So I again say that Gandhiji's India is unchanged till now.

 

[Raja]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

Interesting discussion .

I think ideals laid of Gandhiji we're not even followed religiously then and not even now . Because they are not shortcuts to living .

Infact the ideals were taught and formed then by Gandhiji because things were not good in society even then .

Christ and his teachings were not followed then at that time , hence he was crucified . Same with Gandhiji his teachings and ideals were not followed even then hence he was killed too .

Buddha was the only one who was enlighted then , misery , volience , poverty , disease was even then and it's still now .

Greed , hunger for power , violence was even then and even now .

And things like greed , hunger for power , violence are evolutionary , what they do is just change their look as time moves . There is a shift every decade or a two in overall outlook not just in India but in the whole world .

Back then when Gandhiji was alive caste system and the horrors involved with it were very rampant , violence between religious communities was more then compared to now .

Relatively compared Bombay was more beautiful that's what my dad says compared to what it is now inspite of better infrastructure , malls and technology . And maybe I will have a different view when iam 60 about Mumbai when I will relatively compare it with present and future .

When I was in school we used to sing songs , play physical games . Now in school kids listen to iPods and play games on iPads .

So the intention of gaming as kids stays same just the way it is done changes .

Back then polio , tb , small pox was a killer disease now they are curable but we have cancer , aids and other some other disease which were unheard of then .

Every decade brings a paradigm shift in practically everything but basic evolutionary response because of the malice in human nature stays same .

The basic mantra of Gandhiji's era was " swadeshi " imagine if we follow the same ideals , could we experience what a Toyota or a Honda or a iPhone or a Samsung or a android or a Audi or a Bentley is ?

A society is never problem free , just that problems change their makeup as per time .

And yes basic values laid by Gandhiji are timeless if one follows them , he will be living a idealistic life in a not so idealistic world which was then and even now and will be in future too .

“Generations to come will scarce believe that such a one as this ever in flesh and blood walked upon this earth. "


― Albert Einstein on mahatma Gandhi




So ideals laid by Gandhiji we're not followed then and even now .

 

[ZenandEnfield]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

@ Tornada - you are entitled to your own opinions as are we. Just repeating your views again and again does not make it factual. India is a free country and TAI is a free website, but that freedom does not mean there are no rules for behaving in India and for posting in TAI.

@ Mods - Please see posts from Tornada, there are repeated violations of the Forum rules.

@ Manoj - I appreciate your posts. Even a simple googling of the word India would reveal that the word "India" existed much before the arrival of the English. Oops

Just see the Bible, the book of Esther (written in 480BC) Chapter 1, verse 1- ,Now it came to pass in the days of Ahasuerus, (this is Ahasuerus/Xerxes which reigned, from India even unto Ethiopia, over an hundred and seven and twenty provinces:

and Chapter 8 verse 9 - Then were the king's scribes called at that time in the third month, that is, the month Sivan, on the three and twentieth day thereof; and it was written according to all that Mordecai commanded unto the Jews, and to the lieutenants, and the deputies and rulers of the provinces which are from India unto Ethiopia, an hundred twenty and seven provinces, unto every province according to the writing thereof, and unto every people after their language, and to the Jews according to their writing, and according to their language.

Names of India - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

One doesn't have to be a history professor to know when the English came to India, In the 1600s, but don't believe me, just see the below link.
East India Company - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


One wonders why this degradation has happened?
Is it only in India but also in other countries.
Is it that the education system failed?
Did parents fail to inculcate Gandhiji's values in their children.
Or did a few people keep quiet, afraid of bullies and criminals, and thereby accept such immorality, lack of ethics and good manners as the norm.

 

[Raja]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

@ Tornada - you are entitled to your own opinions as are we. Just repeating your views again and again does not make it factual. India is a free country and TAI is a free website, but that freedom does not mean there are no rules for behaving in India and for posting in TAI.

@ Mods - Please see posts from Tornada, there are repeated violations of the Forum rules.

Friend iam a bit confused here . What makes you think tornado is a violating forum rules here ?

One wonders why this degradation has happened?
Is it only in India but also in other countries.

It's worldwide . In western world it was racisim then , now they have other social problems like drugs and volience .

Is it that the education system failed?

Maybe yes maybe not .
Greed , lust , hunger for power , wealth are evolutionary qualities which are carried forward from generations to generations since Ramayana , Mahabharata . They just change their face and come . It's a malice and junk of human mind .

Did parents fail to inculcate Gandhiji's values in their children.

Maybe we must ask , did parents themselves followed Gandhiji's values in first place ?

Or did a few people keep quiet, afraid of bullies and criminals, and thereby accept such immorality, lack of ethics and good manners as the norm.

In my view I think society is a very dynamic , ever changing and never made of same people for every coward there is a courageous guy. For every corrupted guy there is some one who is honest . For every selfish there is someone who is selfless .
It's upto us to lead the life the way we feel is right . It's a choice which we need to make to live like Gandhiji or hitler .

 

[dharmesh]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

Who are we to claim India is degrading?
how many rapes were reported via media, to common public before 10 years as compared to today? The amount crime happening at that time and today are same. Just that we get to know them via media recently that does not means, it was good then and bad now.

I agree that India is not what freedom fighters dreamed of. But there is no substantial degradation, it was happening then and it is now. Instead, infrastructure has improved, number of roads, number of facilities, etc have improved.

Did parents fail to inculcate Gandhiji's values in their children.

Mahatma Gandhi, a great person, was just a medium of what is already depicted in holy books. Nonviolence, humanity, patience, etc. How many of us read the holy book, which itself is the base source of values?

 

[manojodungat]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

This thread was started basically based on my own observation of moral deterioration in some sections of our society. No way I was comparing it with the time when Gandhiji used to be living physically as some people have quickly concluded. This hastiness, over-speed and impatience are only a few among many that need special attention in our society urgently.

Since it was on the 2nd October, I thought to name the thread after Gandhiji.Also I thought certain ideals and values of Father of our Country are more relevant in order to address certain serious socio-moral issues prevalent today.

One wonders why this degradation has happened?
Is it only in India but also in other countries.
Is it that the education system failed?
Did parents fail to inculcate Gandhiji's values in their children.
Or did a few people keep quiet, afraid of bullies and criminals, and thereby accept such immorality, lack of ethics and good manners as the norm.

Finding answers to each of your questions is the essence and purpose of this thread. I only wish if we could discuss in a way which brings out some sort of positive change among the readers.

The basic mantra of Gandhiji's era was " swadeshi " imagine if we follow the same ideals , could we experience what a Toyota or a Honda or a iPhone or a Samsung or a android or a Audi or a Bentley is ?

Changes are bound to happen- Bentleys, iPhones, androids are only few to name. One needs to use them and make use of them, but I only wish if we all are matured enough to identify and keep the evils away, that come along with them.

So ideals laid by Gandhiji we're not followed then and even now

That could be a reason for the existing mess.

You must be the change you wish to see in the world-Mahathma Gandhi

It's a malice and junk of human mind .

Surprised the way you generalised and simplified the issues.

It's upto us to lead the life the way we feel is right .

When each and every individual start living the way he or she wants to live and not as per a common good in the society, the degradation is inevitable.

 

[Raja]

Re: Gandhiji's India is changing !

Who are we to claim India is degrading?
how many rapes were reported via media, to common public before 10 years as compared to today? The amount crime happening at that time and today are same. Just that we get to know them via media recently that does not means, it was good then and bad now.

I agree that India is not what freedom fighters dreamed of. But there is no substantial degradation, it was happening then and it is now. Instead, infrastructure has improved, number of roads, number of facilities, etc have improved.

True .

What was kidnaping of Sita ? What was " vastra haran " of draupadi ? Like I said lust , greed , power games , hunger for land , wealth , kingdom are evolutionary in terms .
Even if there will be a new Buddha , Gandhiji born to educate there will be equal number of people who will ruin the education by performing opposite acts .

It is upto us to take individual action against something which is not right on whole .

Rama was not able to stop Ravan or change him . What he did was He stood against him . Same way Krishna couldn't stop Mahabharata or change Kavravas . He just stood were truth prevailed . Similarly we must follow what we think is right and move ahead .
If we think Gandhiji and his values are important , we must start following them first then expect others to follow and change .

Anyway this is what Gandhiji taught right ?

I think we can't isolate some problems of the society and bring Gandhiji's values there and declare India or society is in general degrading .

Gandhiji's one of the basic principle was also swadeshi . So can we say we are degrading ourselves by using iPhone , Samsung , Honda , Renault cars Armani shirts and perfumes ? How many are actually using khadi as their day to day wear ? And why are we not all using Indian made phones , cars , tv ?